Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized
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Sorry devils advocate here, I think we had a discussion like this a while back with Lenovo.
Is it Lenovo's fault for not quality controlling the shit-ware they were paid to install into their systems? Or the software manufacturers who built the shit-ware in the first place at fault.
What levels does MS have to go through, how far of testing?
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@DustinB3403 said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
Sorry devils advocate here, I think we had a discussion like this a while back with Lenovo.
Is it Lenovo's fault for not quality controlling the shit-ware they were paid to install into their systems? Or the software manufacturers who built the shit-ware in the first place at fault.
What levels does MS have to go through, how far of testing?
If you're packaging it with your own software you have at least some of the blame. I'd honestly say both.
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@wirestyle22 Of course, but the BIOS isn't really MS's beast is it.
Sure MS has some blame, but you don't sue a car maker for a drunk driver killing your family do you?
You sue the drunk.
Edit: you only sue the car manufacturer if you have some leg to stand on, like known faulty seat belts or something.
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@DustinB3403 said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
Microsoft often gets system patches from hardware manufacturers that they push out through Windows Updates.
So how is MS at fault?
I think it is self explanatory.
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@DustinB3403 said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
Is it Lenovo's fault for not quality controlling the shit-ware they were paid to install into their systems?
Yes, Lenovo is totally at fault. I see zero grey area. Are other people at fault as well? Maybe. But not guilt elsewhere removes guilt from Lenovo.
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@DustinB3403 said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
What levels does MS have to go through, how far of testing?
A lot. Anyone can make a mistake. But the buck stops here. MS chooses to deploy it, MS stands behind it, MS puts their name on it, MS pushes it through their system, MS depends on people to trust them.
If this was Red Hat, Ubuntu or anyone else, there would be no one with fingers pointed at except the people who put it into the repo. MS is the party involved here. If someone else is involved, that is both speculation and largely irrelevant.
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@scottalanmiller said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
@DustinB3403 said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
Is it Lenovo's fault for not quality controlling the shit-ware they were paid to install into their systems?
Yes, Lenovo is totally at fault. I see zero grey area. Are other people at fault as well? Maybe. But not guilt elsewhere removes guilt from Lenovo.
Of course, I agree with that, because they clearly didn't look at the software at all, or did and said hrm... pile of money or no pile of money.
But show me proof that MS is building BIOS patches and then I would agree they are at fault. How often are users actually going out and looking for BIOS patches?
If not for MS they would likely never get patched ever.
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@wirestyle22 said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
If you're packaging it with your own software you have at least some of the blame. I'd honestly say both.
I'd only maybe say both. If someone wants to push out malware through Lenovo and pays Lenovo to push it, is it their fault? You are not their customer. You are only Lenovo's customer. Lenovo alone is the company whose job it is to protect you. The other company just is some random third party paying to see what unethical vendor will deploy their malware.
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@DustinB3403 said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
@wirestyle22 Of course, but the BIOS isn't really MS's beast is it.
Sure MS has some blame, but you don't sue a car maker for a drunk driver killing your family do you?
You sue the drunk.
Edit: you only sue the car manufacturer if you have some leg to stand on, like known faulty seat belts or something.
Right, Microsoft is the drunk here, not the liquor company.
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@DustinB3403 said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
If not for MS they would likely never get patched ever.
If you feel MS is providing patches, then why do you need additional proof that they are pushing patches?
If they choose to push patches, that is their own prerogative and any problems that arise from that are their responsibility. It's that simple.
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I disagree.
I feel that MS is talking to the vendors of the world and saying hey "we can help deliver a better product" (bios patches) through WU. But you need to build them.
Sure MS can proof them, but MS isn't the master of that realm. They are the car, not the drunk.
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@DustinB3403 said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
Sure MS can proof them, but MS isn't the master of that realm. They are the car, not the drunk.
MS chooses to deploy them. It's the deploying that causes the problem. MS and MS alone controls that. MS is the sole chooser, provider, gateway and responsible party here.
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I side with Scott on this one
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I had a friend contact me because her computer would not boot. Exact same issue. No one has run into this yet?
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I'll side with Dustin here. Will MS still help you solve the problem because it came from WU? Probably, but really this is a manufacturer's fault for providing a bad BIOS update to MS. But bad driver updates have been a problem in WU for so long that I NEVER install drivers from MS. I've had more than a few bad drivers from WU, I always get them on my own.
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@Dashrender said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
I'll side with Dustin here. Will MS still help you solve the problem because it came from WU? Probably, but really this is a manufacturer's fault for providing a bad BIOS update to MS.
Not to me. The manufacturer did not provide it to me, MS did. No one but MS and me are involved. If MS has an upstream provider not doing their job, that is purely between MS and them. By the time that it gets to me, MS alone is responsible for it.
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@scottalanmiller said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
@Dashrender said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
I'll side with Dustin here. Will MS still help you solve the problem because it came from WU? Probably, but really this is a manufacturer's fault for providing a bad BIOS update to MS.
Not to me. The manufacturer did not provide it to me, MS did. No one but MS and me are involved. If MS has an upstream provider not doing their job, that is purely between MS and them. By the time that it gets to me, MS alone is responsible for it.
And I gave that to you by saying that MS will help you fix it, which I know from experience when a RAID controller driver was updated by WU and hosed my system over a decade ago.
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@Dashrender said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
@scottalanmiller said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
@Dashrender said in Windows 10 Update -- Hard Drive No Longer Recognized:
I'll side with Dustin here. Will MS still help you solve the problem because it came from WU? Probably, but really this is a manufacturer's fault for providing a bad BIOS update to MS.
Not to me. The manufacturer did not provide it to me, MS did. No one but MS and me are involved. If MS has an upstream provider not doing their job, that is purely between MS and them. By the time that it gets to me, MS alone is responsible for it.
And I gave that to you by saying that MS will help you fix it, which I know from experience when a RAID controller driver was updated by WU and hosed my system over a decade ago.
Sure they will fix it. But not because they want to, because they are responsible for it.
