Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?
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What's the problem that you are trying to solve by looking at either RDS or VDI? Start there?
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@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
So you prefer terminal services over VDI?
Of course, VDI is just a kludge for situations where you are stuck running bad software that doesn't behave properly with the operating system. You never "want" VDI, it's always a brute force fallback to fix other problems. And it is a unique problem to the Windows world, there is a reason that no other ecosystem talks about VDI... because only Windows software is considered acceptable to have been written so poorly.
While I'm sure this thinking is incorrect, at the same time, when has Apple ever had a server based solution like this at all? I've never personally seen another solution besides RDS or VDI both involving windows... but I know 'nix can do this, just never seen an actual use of it.
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@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
So you prefer terminal services over VDI?
Of course, VDI is just a kludge for situations where you are stuck running bad software that doesn't behave properly with the operating system. You never "want" VDI, it's always a brute force fallback to fix other problems. And it is a unique problem to the Windows world, there is a reason that no other ecosystem talks about VDI... because only Windows software is considered acceptable to have been written so poorly.
While I'm sure this thinking is incorrect, at the same time, when has Apple ever had a server based solution like this at all? I've never personally seen another solution besides RDS or VDI both involving windows... but I know 'nix can do this, just never seen an actual use of it.
Right, the Mac world is a little tough to use as an example because they very much just do their own thing and it is more about what they let you do than what their users want to do.
But the UNIX world in general had terminal services AND VDI long before Windows did... and while it WAS used, it was never used very much because most of the time, it's a really silly thing. It has very little value.
You still need physical devices for end users, only now you need special case ones. So there really isn't a cost savings on hardware, especially once you consider the huge server side resources needed. It generally puts network usage through the roof as you are passing around all kinds of graphical data that you didn't need at all before. It makes everything so much more complex.
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@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
So you prefer terminal services over VDI?
Of course, VDI is just a kludge for situations where you are stuck running bad software that doesn't behave properly with the operating system. You never "want" VDI, it's always a brute force fallback to fix other problems. And it is a unique problem to the Windows world, there is a reason that no other ecosystem talks about VDI... because only Windows software is considered acceptable to have been written so poorly.
While I'm sure this thinking is incorrect, at the same time, when has Apple ever had a server based solution like this at all? I've never personally seen another solution besides RDS or VDI both involving windows... but I know 'nix can do this, just never seen an actual use of it.
Linux has had it for at least 20 years
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@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
So you prefer terminal services over VDI?
Of course, VDI is just a kludge for situations where you are stuck running bad software that doesn't behave properly with the operating system. You never "want" VDI, it's always a brute force fallback to fix other problems. And it is a unique problem to the Windows world, there is a reason that no other ecosystem talks about VDI... because only Windows software is considered acceptable to have been written so poorly.
While I'm sure this thinking is incorrect, at the same time, when has Apple ever had a server based solution like this at all? I've never personally seen another solution besides RDS or VDI both involving windows... but I know 'nix can do this, just never seen an actual use of it.
Linux has had it for at least 20 years
And UNIX for another 20 years before that!
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A key difference between UNIX and Windows is that Windows needs a layer on top of itself in order to allow TS / RDS to happen. On UNIX, there is ONLY a terminal server mode. All connections to a UNIX desktop are over a network and multi-user. That's why the software problem doesn't exist on UNIX. It can't. If software didn't work in a TS mode, it wouldn't work at all, ever. Windows has "different modes" so things that work with Windows don't always work with terminal services.
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@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
So you prefer terminal services over VDI?
Of course, VDI is just a kludge for situations where you are stuck running bad software that doesn't behave properly with the operating system. You never "want" VDI, it's always a brute force fallback to fix other problems. And it is a unique problem to the Windows world, there is a reason that no other ecosystem talks about VDI... because only Windows software is considered acceptable to have been written so poorly.
While I'm sure this thinking is incorrect, at the same time, when has Apple ever had a server based solution like this at all? I've never personally seen another solution besides RDS or VDI both involving windows... but I know 'nix can do this, just never seen an actual use of it.
Linux has had it for at least 20 years
So has windows. Actually windows has had it natively since Windows 2000, but has been available since NT 3.5 or 3.51 (perhaps before that).
And as Scott said, Unix has had it nearly forever.
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My use case is that I hoped to give our employees Surface Pro's and use Office 365 for everything. But, onedrive can't handle syncing all the data. Everyone needs to be able to quickly browse a few hundred GB of cad files at a moments notice.
The alternative is syncing several hundred thousand files to everyone computer, which even Dropbox warns against.
We are all very mobile, and I do like that I can remote in and get to my desktop from my iPhone or wherever I may be without my laptop.
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I'm lost, how does the RDS/VDI get a connection to hundreds of thousands but a Windows laptop (Surface Pro) can't?
As your users mobile? So the assumption is that users will be accessing the VDI remotely?
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@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
So you prefer terminal services over VDI?
Of course, VDI is just a kludge for situations where you are stuck running bad software that doesn't behave properly with the operating system. You never "want" VDI, it's always a brute force fallback to fix other problems. And it is a unique problem to the Windows world, there is a reason that no other ecosystem talks about VDI... because only Windows software is considered acceptable to have been written so poorly.
While I'm sure this thinking is incorrect, at the same time, when has Apple ever had a server based solution like this at all? I've never personally seen another solution besides RDS or VDI both involving windows... but I know 'nix can do this, just never seen an actual use of it.
Linux has had it for at least 20 years
So has windows. Actually windows has had it natively since Windows 2000, but has been available since NT 3.5 or 3.51 (perhaps before that).
And as Scott said, Unix has had it nearly forever.
natively meaning "from the original vendor" but it isn't native in the graphical subsystem.
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@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
My use case is that I hoped to give our employees Surface Pro's and use Office 365 for everything.
Office 365 would push you AWAY from RDS, not towards it. You want your processing done on the Surface Pros (not a device I would ever give to an employee I wanted to keep) not on a server and displayed by the Surface Pros.
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@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
Everyone needs to be able to quickly browse a few hundred GB of cad files at a moments notice.
You want to look at CAD .... on a Surface Pro?
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@Dashrender I'd prefer terminal over vdi, just to be clear.
Yes all users are mobile especially when they need to access the data most.
So rdp in and access server where files are immediately accessible to network share, versus cloud sync to every remote user.
VPN is much slower in this case than remotely browsing and viewing files through rdp
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@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
We are all very mobile, and I do like that I can remote in and get to my desktop from my iPhone or wherever I may be without my laptop.
But VDI doesn't enable that. nor does RDS. That's just remote access, a very different conversation from virtualizing or moving to server side desktop processing.
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@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
The alternative is syncing several hundred thousand files to everyone computer, which even Dropbox warns against.
That's not a good option.
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@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
VPN is much slower in this case than remotely browsing and viewing files through rdp
Of course. But my first thought would be to just enable remote access to desktops, not to replace the desktops. It's remote access that enables this, not removing the desktop.
When I was on Wall St., all security was done through our desktop instances. So to get access we had to access them remotely. but we didn't go to thin clients.
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@scottalanmiller The way Microsoft calls everything RDS now I am not sure it is clear what I am saying.
But regardless, its definitely a remote access issue. An issue where multiple people in different places need to access a larger amount of data. So Remote Desktop Session Host (terminal services) is what will solve the problem. Or are you suggesting something else.
The VDI question was more out of curiosity should I want to try something more graphics intensive.
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What do you users have today? Do they have a desktop today? If yes, then just give the users a laptop, setup an RDS gateway, and have all of the client desktops register with it and you're done. Remote access to Windows Pro is included.
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If you don't have Windows Desktops today, then you have to look to options... do you give everyone a desktop (perhaps these people aren't in the office, they don't have cubes for a desktop) or setup RDS. The question is, will your application run in RDS server setup?
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@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
If you don't have Windows Desktops today, then you have to look to options... do you give everyone a desktop (perhaps these people aren't in the office, they don't have cubes for a desktop) or setup RDS. The question is, will your application run in RDS server setup?
And there is I think the key question between VDI and RDSH, right? Will the app work. Does the work environment require occasional user access to admin/install apps or finicky software.
In our case, we are splitting a company in two, and I am going to have to buy stuff. So its a bit of a "start from scratch" scenario. In the past, the problem was never truly solved. Lots of selective syncing, VPN, whatever each man wanted.
